Closure . . . I Guess
For those of you concerned with the ongoing troubles in the church here, the ACU center for Conflict resolution came and helped us all work out an agreement of sorts. Essentially, a very large number of the members of the congregation got together with the conflict resolution guys and told them what we felt was wrong, they boiled it down to "intrests," and then talked to the elders. Though two of the three were out of town during our actual meeting with them, the third apologised on behalf of all of them and then issued their blessing on us to start a new congregation or come back as we saw fit.
Some of you have expressed concern over how we are feeling and acting in relationship to the eldership, so let me address that: we disagree. That is neither a sin, nor rebellion, we just have an irreconcilable view of God and his word. Now that the nam-calling has stopped and a blessing has been given, as far as Gina (and Steve) and I are concerned, the problem is resolved. They asked us to, if I remember the wording (and correct the placement of the adjective), "go where you think your talents can best be used," so we are. We've decided to so with the smaller group for now, and I think that they will eventually pursue starting a church-plant.
Most of our concerns were addressed, but the largest concern for most of us who were meeting elsewhere was not. In fact, they did not say exactly why Mike was excommunicated, and did not revoke their ban on his attendance. To tell the truth, I understand where they are coming from, but it is bad theology, and will lead to even worse mistakes in the future, so I cannot support it; I won't condemn them for it either, though, as long as they are willing to accept that people with whom they disagree are not evil for objecting.
I think that their action in disfellowshiping someone without biblical support is a sin, and so is the way they treated us all, but that is over. The act of excommunication is complete, and like divorce, in the past, it was a sin, but it, like all of our sins, even those we don't recognize, has been forgiven by God (I am confident) and forgiven by our family. Like so many other sins, though, it has resulted in negative consequences, but that is the nature of sin, and God is big enough to use it to his glory in the end. Amen.
Personally, my objection is against perpetuated ignorance, and will always be. I only wish ill on people if it will help them to change. Sometimes I pray, "God give them what they deserve," but only if I think what they deserve is enough of a kick-in-the-pants to get them to recognize the nature of the problem and an attainable solution. In this case, I wanted people to express doubt in their leadership and withdraw support for them, while remaining faithful to God. That happened, and they learned some important lessons, I hope that those they did not learn yet will not have to be learned through such severe consequences, and I hope that those I have to learn will not have to be learned through consequences too dire, either.
Second, from day one, Mike and Dale and the other leaders among us have been saying that if we have to start a new congregation, we want to base it on positive motives, not negative.
We've largely refrained from talking about things, except to take stock of objections for the purpose of conflict resolution, and we have talked about the sins that we are likely to fall into far more than the sins we believe were comitted by others.
As with everything, we always suggest that prayer is the biggest part of the answer . . . because it is. We are also, though, trying to cultivate love and humility, though that is difficult for some of us, and will take time.
I have always tried to be the type of person who can admit to his faults and who will try to change when he finds out that his life is not the best it can be. I'm not perfect, but that is my goal, and I pursue that goal by praying one of the most ancient Christian prayers, "O lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner," and I will continue in prayer for the rest of my life. I try not to be arrogant, but I also try not to practice false humility, or underestimate my actions, which would be just as against the truth, and at least a destructive for someone with my psychological makeup
Some of you have expressed concern over how we are feeling and acting in relationship to the eldership, so let me address that: we disagree. That is neither a sin, nor rebellion, we just have an irreconcilable view of God and his word. Now that the nam-calling has stopped and a blessing has been given, as far as Gina (and Steve) and I are concerned, the problem is resolved. They asked us to, if I remember the wording (and correct the placement of the adjective), "go where you think your talents can best be used," so we are. We've decided to so with the smaller group for now, and I think that they will eventually pursue starting a church-plant.
Most of our concerns were addressed, but the largest concern for most of us who were meeting elsewhere was not. In fact, they did not say exactly why Mike was excommunicated, and did not revoke their ban on his attendance. To tell the truth, I understand where they are coming from, but it is bad theology, and will lead to even worse mistakes in the future, so I cannot support it; I won't condemn them for it either, though, as long as they are willing to accept that people with whom they disagree are not evil for objecting.
I think that their action in disfellowshiping someone without biblical support is a sin, and so is the way they treated us all, but that is over. The act of excommunication is complete, and like divorce, in the past, it was a sin, but it, like all of our sins, even those we don't recognize, has been forgiven by God (I am confident) and forgiven by our family. Like so many other sins, though, it has resulted in negative consequences, but that is the nature of sin, and God is big enough to use it to his glory in the end. Amen.
Personally, my objection is against perpetuated ignorance, and will always be. I only wish ill on people if it will help them to change. Sometimes I pray, "God give them what they deserve," but only if I think what they deserve is enough of a kick-in-the-pants to get them to recognize the nature of the problem and an attainable solution. In this case, I wanted people to express doubt in their leadership and withdraw support for them, while remaining faithful to God. That happened, and they learned some important lessons, I hope that those they did not learn yet will not have to be learned through such severe consequences, and I hope that those I have to learn will not have to be learned through consequences too dire, either.
Second, from day one, Mike and Dale and the other leaders among us have been saying that if we have to start a new congregation, we want to base it on positive motives, not negative.
We've largely refrained from talking about things, except to take stock of objections for the purpose of conflict resolution, and we have talked about the sins that we are likely to fall into far more than the sins we believe were comitted by others.
As with everything, we always suggest that prayer is the biggest part of the answer . . . because it is. We are also, though, trying to cultivate love and humility, though that is difficult for some of us, and will take time.
I have always tried to be the type of person who can admit to his faults and who will try to change when he finds out that his life is not the best it can be. I'm not perfect, but that is my goal, and I pursue that goal by praying one of the most ancient Christian prayers, "O lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner," and I will continue in prayer for the rest of my life. I try not to be arrogant, but I also try not to practice false humility, or underestimate my actions, which would be just as against the truth, and at least a destructive for someone with my psychological makeup
posted by Unknown at
8:39 PM
2 Comments:
That seems like a let down. I'm sorry.
I love that you want to start a new church, but I feel obligated to offer some advice.
If the church that you plant is a reaction against the church you left then basically you will get a church of christians who want their own way (I know that not everyone will be like this). I know you know Stan Granberg - you should give him a call or send him an e-mail. There are so many good resources to help in your situation.
My gut says that you should probably not start a new church for about a year. That will give time for emotions to cool and for those who are committed to starting to a new church to work through all the details of the process. It's kinda like a relationship--the rebound after the break-up doesn't last. Give yourselve time to heal and make good decisions.
Just my opinion.
Thanks James, that is almost exactly what we've all been saying around here (though I was gone for a month, so I couldn't say much of anything). We're all trying not to let this be about the situation, about other people. To tell the truth, Mike Sanders has said from day one that if we let this be a reaction, then we're only going to fail, and I'm with him.
I'm almost there on the one year wait, too, but I'd need some clarification. You see, some of the people are . . . disallowed attendance at El Dorado, so they've got to find something else, and I personally want to see something good actually come of this, but, in the two similar situations I witnessed as a child, nothing good came precisely because people just decided to go to other churches instead of trying to find a process that would bring them to the church planting stage (or took a year or more at other places before deciding, which meant that the people with most potential had already become enmeshed in other churches).
So, I agree if you are saying that we should not tack a shingle up for a good long time, but if you are saying that we should go elsewhere for the time-being (which I doubt, knowing you, but which your actual words might indicate) then I'd disagree.
As for Stan, he is the name I'm hoping to suggest, though we have three other names already in the discussion. In short, it looks like what you are suggesting is exactly what Mike and others are trying to implement. Many of us have stressed taking the time to do this right and to get guidance from experts.
Post a Comment
Subscribe to Post Comments [Atom]
<< Home